In the final episode of the season, HBR editor Adi Ignatius interviews Jason Buechel, the CEO of Whole Foods. Buechel discusses the challenges of succeeding a larger-than-life executive, the role of Whole Foods as a subsidiary of Amazon, and how the company is addressing changes in the business environment, such as climate change and hybrid work. Buechel emphasizes the importance of understanding the voice of team members during a leadership transition and being authentic as a leader. He also highlights Whole Foods’ focus on growth opportunities for employees and its commitment to sustainability. Buechel believes that AI will fundamentally change the retail and grocery shopping experience in the next decade. The episode concludes with Buechel sharing his favorite products from Whole Foods.
Jason Buechel, the CEO of Whole Foods, faced a unique challenge when he took over from cofounder John Mackey, who had been the company’s CEO for 42 years. Buechel, who became CEO in 2022, had the opportunity to work closely with Mackey for nine years and had an srcsrc-month transition period to prepare for the role. However, stepping into the shoes of a larger-than-life executive like Mackey was not only a personal challenge but a significant adjustment for Whole Foods employees, from the C-suite to the hundreds of local stores.
Buechel recognized the importance of connecting with the team members, addressing their concerns, and assuring them that the company’s culture, quality standards, and core values would remain intact under his leadership. He emphasized the need for authenticity and being true to oneself while also supporting the company’s vision and direction.
For this episode of our video series “The New World of Work”, HBR editor in chief Adi Ignatius sat down with Buechel to discuss:
How authenticity is crucial in leadership and sustainability efforts, as companies need to ensure their actions align with their core values and mission
How focusing on the happiness, growth, and development of employees not only leads to higher employee retention but improves customers’ experience
While CEO roles can vary depending on the company, for Buechel the focus is primarily on internal leadership and supporting the vision and growth of the organization
“The New World of Work” explores how top-tier executives see the future and how their companies are trying to set themselves up for success. Each week, Ignatius talks to a top leader on LinkedIn Live — previous interviews included Microsoft CEO Satya Nadella and former PepsiCo CEO Indra Nooyi. He also shares an inside look at these conversations —and solicits questions for future discussions — in a newsletter just for HBR subscribers. If you’re a subscriber, you can sign up here.
ADI IGNATIUS:
Jason, welcome. Let’s start with your transition to CEO. It’s always interesting how a founder CEO transitions to the next generation of leadership. Talk about that challenge and what you’ve tried to bring to that role.
JASON BUECHEL:
One of the fortunes I had was working with John [Mackey] over the course of nine years and had about an srcsrc-month timeframe to do our transition. It was a great opportunity for me to be able to jump into the role. I had a lot of great support from John where he really wanted me to help take on some of those responsibilities over the course of the srcsrc months. I was prepared when my day was to step formally into the role.
Stepping into shoes like that is also a really difficult process for our team members. John was our CEO for 42 years, and ultimately that’s what they knew. For me, it was really important to connect with our team members, make sure that we could provide a vision and that they understood the elements of Whole Foods Market, our culture, our core values, our higher purpose. They were going to remain intact, and my job was to help take those responsibilities and support us being able to keep Whole Foods and the important elements intact.
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ADI IGNATIUS:
At HBR, we love to give people practical takeaways. You’re not the first and you won’t be the last to succeed an iconic CEO who’s been in place for many years. What’s your advice to people who are in your role and coming in? What have you learned from the process that you’d like to share?
JASON BUECHEL:
It’s important to understand the voice of the team members. What are they looking for in that transition and what’s important for them? For me, I took an opportunity over those srcsrc months to do something we call the Whole Conversations Tour, which gave me some great insights for what was on the mind of our team members.
In some cases, they had fears with John’s retirement of whether there are going to be major changes to our culture or our quality standards? What are things going to look like going forward? For our stakeholders, whether it was suppliers or customers, community partners, I think it’s important to understand the voice of all of those stakeholders as you’re making the transition.
I think the other part I would give advice on is making sure that you’re not just trying to be that leader. For me, John and I, we lead in very different ways and that’s why we were so complementary in working together.
It’s also about being authentic to yourself and at the same time making sure that you’re supporting the company and where it needs to go.
ADI IGNATIUS:
Your path to CEO is not typical. Maybe no one’s is, but yours in particular isn’t. Talk about your past and your life and career and how it ended up in this role?
JASON BUECHEL:
I’ve had the opportunity to work in retail since 2000. My first set of experiences really came through consulting. I worked for Accenture and had an opportunity to work with a lot of leading retailers and grocers, both here in the US and around the world. It was that passion I had in working within the retail space.
That career allowed me to connect with several executives at Whole Foods Market, our former Co-CEO, Walter Robb and CFO, Glenda Flanagan. As they were looking to hire a new CIO or CTO, they had reached out to me. I had provided some names of some clients that I thought would be good folks to go for the job, and they reached back out and said, “Why aren’t you putting your name on? We’d really love for you to consider joining Whole Foods.”
I came to Austin, spent two days here, and just really had an amazing appreciation for the fact that the higher purpose and core values weren’t just words on a wall. They were being lived out day-to-day. That was the awakening that this is the right place for me to go work and spend the rest of my career.
As I joined Whole Foods, I was responsible for technology as well as our digital businesses. Helping stand up both our delivery and pickup businesses, which we hadn’t yet launched. During that timeframe, I also helped looked at ways for us to establish some organizations and support practices we didn’t have before like our first operations support team.
As I spent more time at Whole Foods, I picked up additional responsibilities in areas like team-member services (what other companies would call HR), and eventually stepped into the chief operating officer role in January of 20src9. And going through that role really helped prepare me in taking the next step up to the CEO position.
ADI IGNATIUS:
I was thinking about your past even before that. When I first got in contact with your staff, they said “He’s a cheese guy. You have to understand that.”
JASON BUECHEL:
Absolutely. I’ve had a long connection to food, been gardening since I was seven. My dad actually was a cheese maker. Both of my parents grew up on dairy farms. I was in rural Wisconsin and just have an interesting connection to our food systems and couldn’t be happier to have the opportunity today to be in a role where I can help influence and support our food systems for future generations.
ADI IGNATIUS:
What does it mean for Whole Foods to report up to a giant, Amazon.com?
JASON BUECHEL:
We are very privileged in a number of ways. First and foremost, one of the things we’ve been really excited about over the last six years is we’re really focused on the long-term of Whole Foods Market and being able to have the support of Amazon providing us with capabilities that allow us to serve our customer in the most amazing ways possible. Whether it’s through technology or other services, being able to help create great customer experiences is one of the things that Amazon has been helpful with.
Also, we’re helping redefine what grocery is going to look like in this space. Having a parent company that has resources and expertise that we can plug into and utilize to support Whole Foods is really important.
I also appreciate the same things where we’re able to be Whole Foods and maintain our culture. I mentioned earlier we still have the same higher purpose and core values. While we’re part of Amazon, it’s really a complementary relationship where we bring the very best of what we can offer and we’re able to plug in and leverage the very best within Amazon.
ADI IGNATIUS:
I think we have emotional connections to the brands that we like. What do you say to people who love the Whole Foods brand and its brand promise, but don’t feel the same emotion toward Amazon?
JASON BUECHEL:
In some cases it’s helping those customers understand some of the benefits that they can use, that Amazon can support them as well. Whether it’s providing a quicker checkout in one of our stores using Amazon One, or ultimately some of the support and work, where we’re collaboratively looking at ways by which we’re going to help meet our environmental and sustainability commitments.
That’s something a lot of our customers care about and something we’re able to leverage as Whole Foods and supporting our core value around the environment.
ADI IGNATIUS:
What do you see as Whole Foods’ biggest challenges? Is it simply to grow as quickly as possible, to add new stores? Or do you think about it in some other way?
JASON BUECHEL:
It’s really figuring out how we expand our reach and impact. One of the ways we’ll do that obviously is adding new stores, but it’s also finding new ways that we can serve customers.
One of the things we launched earlier this year is the ability to have items directly shipped to our customer’s homes through Amazon. We currently have over 800 products available within our exclusive brands, our 365 brand as an example. That’s something we can serve more customers in new ways.
We’re also really focused on ways we can help support our higher purpose in nourishing people on the planet. It’s not just growth for growth’s sake, but how do we help be the force for change?
One of the things I’m really passionate about is regenerative agriculture. This is an opportunity that’s ultimately going to allow us to take the products that we know and love today and make sure that we can continue to produce those for future generations.
ADI IGNATIUS:
For people who aren’t familiar with the idea of regenerative products or agriculture, what does that that mean?
JASON BUECHEL:
This is an area where I think a lot of consumers don’t understand that our current topsoil continues to lose the nutrients that it needs to produce the products that we know and love. Regenerative is about not only helping bring those nutrients back into the soil, but help in a sustainable way. To make sure that we can continue to support our soil and the broader biological environments not only to continue to produce the products that we know and love today, but ultimately create an ecosystem where it’s not as disruptive as what we’re seeing today. How do we make sure that we can partner with our suppliers so they can support these practices and be an advocate for them?
One of the things I’m really proud of is that we’ve already launched three regenerative products under our own exclusive brands to help take that leadership position. One of my personal favorites is our green lentils under our Whole Foods Market brand, a great product. And it’s one of the very first certified regenerative products from a private label perspective on the market.
ADI IGNATIUS:
Your strategy, if I understand it, seems essentially still to be primarily a brick and mortar one. Do you feel the need to become more of an e-tailer going forward?
JASON BUECHEL:
The reality is we are an e-tailer today. Whether you are having products delivered to your house, you’re picking them up in one of our stores, you’re getting some of our exclusive brand products like our 365 products shipped directly to your home: we’re already playing in that space. I continue to see that we’ll have opportunities both in the physical experience as well as online.
A lot of our customers like to shop through multiple different channels. In some cases they’d like to have center of store picked for them and ready for them to pick it up when they shop the store, and then look at our perimeter, whether it’s picking out their own meat or seafood or interacting with our team members. As an example, at our cheese case, a certified cheese professional can help choose exactly the right cheeses as you’re putting together your cheeseboard and charcuterie plates.
ADI IGNATIUS:
So fast-forward, not way into the future, but a year or two or three. How do you think the in-store experience will change for Whole Foods customers?
JASON BUECHEL:
We’re going to continue to find ways to help simplify and make things easier for our customers. One of the things our customers find value in is our ability to help save them time. In some cases, as I mentioned earlier, delivery and pickup help support that. We want to be able to find ways that customers can find products in the store faster. How can we better provide the expertise across all the different areas within our stores so customers can make sure we’re supporting the amazing events and dinners they’re helping prepare for their family and loved ones, and ultimately, checking out faster in our stores?
There’s a lot of things we’re making investments on where technology will support things, and investments into our team-member experience, to make sure that our team members can best serve our customers and help save them time.
ADI IGNATIUS:
I want to go to an audience question. This is from Holly who’s in Boston. Do you have any recommendations for how companies can best develop an internal leader to be the next CEO, including maybe external development programs?
JASON BUECHEL:
One of the things I’m really, really proud of is the investment we put into our team member experience and focus around internal growth and development. We had over srcsrc,000 promotions over the last src2 months, which I’m so proud of.
For example, when I look at my executive team, two of my direct reports actually started in our stores part-time. Our head of operations, Bill Jordan, as an example, joined through Mrs. Gooch’s [Natural Food Markets], which was one of our acquisitions. He’s worked across almost every part of our stores, multiple regions, and now leads operations reporting directly to me for all of Whole Foods Market.
We’re making big investments into career development programs. We do this for our major leadership positions within the organization. Just yesterday, I was actually doing the keynote graduation ceremony for our store team leader career development program which is focused on a six-month period, helping make sure our team members are ready to take that next step up.
For our most senior leadership positions, we’ve helped cross-pollinate and have leaders work across multiple different parts of the company. That was something I was privileged to be part of, being able to lead multiple different functions before stepping into this role.
One of the other things that’s really unique for us is both for our executive team and something we call WFLN, which is the Whole Foods Market Leadership Network, built of our src9 most senior leaders. We collectively work together across all different facets. Folks are helping participate in work in parts of the company they may not lead. For us, it’s really making sure we’re working together as a team and helping make sure we’re bringing some of those experiences and expertise across our entire leadership team.
I’m also really proud of the fact that 50% of the group I just mentioned grew up in our stores, and so that expertise of knowing Whole Foods and being able to build a career in a functional area is something we’re really proud of.
ADI IGNATIUS:
Let’s shift gears a little bit. This is another audience question, from Punjab, Pakistan, and it’s about hybrid work. How do you manage the fact that your frontline workers need to be there full-time in the stores, versus white collar workers who are able to work hybrid? How do you balance that?
JASON BUECHEL:
We’ve done a return to office where our store support team members are required to be in the office three days a week, but ultimately many of them also have to spend time in our stores or in our facilities, helping connect with team members.
One of the things that’s been an important part of our vision is something I call store-centricity, in making sure that every single one of our store support team members has a connection to our stores. We ultimately have included it in something we call our job-dialogue process, which is part of our performance management process, on setting the expectation, and ultimately having team members talk about the things they’ve done over the course of the last src2 months to connect with our stores, and what those experiences have taught them.
We’ve also built some programs around our senior leadership and other leaders that we have within our store support group, and actually pairing them with stores and partnering up with our store team leaders, and finding ways that we can better support our stores, and ultimately making sure that we can bring those experiences where our store support team members really understand everything that’s happening day-to-day in a store, what it takes to lead a store, and how do we help improve our team member and customer experiences in the work that we do.
ADI IGNATIUS:
To build on that, you used the phrase before, the theater of retail. I love that term. When you think about Whole Foods, the Whole Foods experience, what is your theater of retail?
JASON BUECHEL:
For so many of our customers, they’re coming to Whole Foods as an oasis, to get out of the hectic day-to-day life, you know? One of my favorite examples of that is our Manhattan West store, located in Hudson Yards in Manhattan, and you get off the busy street and you walk in the store, and it’s just an immediate sense of Zen. For me, we want to be able to create this oasis for customers, bring the theater of retail.
We want our customers to have sensory overloads in the experiences they have, as they’re walking into produce, the smells that they’re having, the beautiful merchandising that they’re seeing, the demos of products that we’re doing in the store. We can be at our very best when we’re helping bring this theater to life for our customers, because it’s one of the reasons they’re coming to our stores.
ADI IGNATIUS:
We have a question from Reno, Nevada in the US. How does Whole Foods think about the phenomenon of food deserts. You aren’t everywhere. You’re in markets that can sustain it. How do you think about the food desert issue, at least in the US, and whether there’s anything you can do to alleviate that.
JASON BUECHEL:
This is one of the areas we’ve actually made investments in and have tried to find ways to support those who might be underserved or don’t have access to some of the highest quality products we sell at Whole Foods Market. We have an entire foundation that we call Whole Cities, which has been dedicated to some of these efforts, in not only having us establish stores, but ultimately investing in communities through a lot of different programs that can help bring access to food in these underserved communities.
ADI IGNATIUS:
Here’s a question from London in the UK. Having followed a very dynamic, well-profiled CEO, how do you think about the role of the CEO? Does it need to be a very public-facing role, or not necessarily?
JASON BUECHEL:
It really depends upon the company. You know, are you public or private? In our case, we are a subsidiary, and for me, the most important role that I have is internal from that perspective. Obviously, having responsibilities external allows us to support our stakeholders as well, so when I look at the time that I spend, it’s probably 80% on the internal side of things, and in the 20% I’m spending external, it’s really trying to help connect with and support our stakeholders.
I give a great example on this with our suppliers. How do we help bring a voice into other organizations, folks within government, around some of the work that we need to do to help support our farmers and our suppliers and ranchers?
It’s figuring out that right balance, but the responsibility I personally have is serving as our internal leader, and making sure that our team members understand the vision that we have as an organization. I’m spending time directly in our stores, connecting with our team members, making sure that they understand where we are going, and making sure we can get feedback. My job is to be a servant leader in serving our stores. One of the things I really have tried to do is set the tone across the entire organization of us being store-centric.
When we launched our new vision, growing with purpose, in January, one of the commitments we made is that every single one of our stores is being visited by a member of our executive team. There’s eight of us, so for our 535+ stores, we’re spending a lot of time on this road show this year, connecting with our team members, making sure they understand where we’re going and getting their feedback of what they’re seeing. It’s helping us improve and elevate many of the priorities and initiatives we’re doing across the organization.
ADI IGNATIUS:
I don’t think we’ve been through a show this year without talking about generative AI. We have a question from Tampa, Florida, which is just how do you think about AI and how it can, or maybe already is, changing the grocery shopping experience?
JASON BUECHEL:
It’s going to fundamentally change retail and grocery over the course of the next src0 years. To go into one of your earlier questions, this is one of the great things about being a subsidiary of Amazon as well, and being able to leverage capabilities on this side.
When I think about how we work, things are going to change. You know, the role of a merchant, which is very much at the center of retail in how you select product, decisions that you’re going to be making around assortment, and pricing, and merchandising. We’re going to have additional insights and toolsets that AI is going to really influence.
I think about all of the different, amazing things that this is going to provide for customers as well, whether it’s helping build out a shopping list, to helping select products that you’re going to bring together for an amazing meal or experience that you’re preparing for, to helping provide discovery. I think there’s going to be so many different applications in how this is going to make things easier, better, and more impactful for our customers, and at the same time, allowing us to raise the bar on how we look at things like assortment and all of the key things that we do in bringing the experiences to our customers.
ADI IGNATIUS:
You’ve talked a couple times about sustainability, and I know that’s a big priority for you. How does a company go from wanting generally to do the right thing in terms of climate change, in terms of sustainability, to really making it fundamental?
JASON BUECHEL:
First and foremost, it’s important to be authentic. For us, within our core values, the environment has always played a role. The work that we’ve done in supporting the organic movement is an example, which has been the leading climate-friendly agricultural practice over the last several decades. It’s always been part and parcel around how we can make sure that this is authentically connected to the work we’re doing. For us it’s easy, because it ties to our higher purpose of nourishing people on the planet.
When it comes down to doing things just for the sake of hitting metrics and goals, when you’re not thinking about how this ties to why you’re doing it, I think you have to take a step back and really understand, “How does this actually connect to the company’s vision, and the mission, and the goals that we’re trying to do?” If it’s not authentically there, understand the changes that you need to make within the organization to make sure that it is. That would be my top piece of advice.
ADI IGNATIUS:
Here’s a question from Ontario, Canada, about retention: what strategies has the company implemented to retain employees?
JASON BUECHEL:
One of the top things is providing growth opportunities for our team members. I mentioned a little bit earlier we had srcsrc,000 promotions over the last src2 months. One of the things that’s important about doing that is providing ways by which we can help support our team members’ growth and happiness.
One area I’m excited about is an apprentice program. We currently have three live, a Butcher Apprentice program, a Certified Cheese Professional, and a Bakery Decorator Apprentice. We’re going to be rolling this out so each one of our departments and teams has an apprentice program going forward. This allows team members to develop skills and trades they can use at Whole Foods Market and elsewhere in their life.
It’s not only great for the team member, but it’s great for our customers: our customers are actually coming to Whole Foods Market for the great expertise and experience we can provide. By having things like this in place, it makes sure that our team members are supported in taking those next steps for growth within the company.
I mentioned a little bit earlier the career development programs we do. We do this throughout our entire organization, so we’ve got programs from multiple levels within our store, around store leadership as an example. Team members not only see their current next-step opportunities, but they see the growth and support they’re going to have at future levels as well.
One other area that I’m proud of is something called Cultivate. It’s a mentoring program that we have in place, and this is very unique to Whole Foods Market. Most other retailers might offer this type of program for their store team leader or store leadership. We open up all this for our team members so they have opportunities to connect with other folks to get supporting, coaching, mentoring experiences.
I have a great example of connecting the two where we have a team member, Marie in Hawaii, who’s connected with a mentor who’s in Boston, and the experience that she’s able to have virtually in a wonderful way to learn things that allow her not only to grow, but bring new experiences into her store. Examples like that have team members not only connected to Whole Foods, but knowing that they’re supported for an entire career they can have with us.
ADI IGNATIUS:
We’re almost out of time, but I want to ask the cliche question you probably get all the time. When I interviewed Howard Schultz when he was CEO of Starbucks, I had to ask, what does he order when he walks up to the barista. So when you shop Whole Foods, what’s in your basket? What are some of your favorites?
JASON BUECHEL:
Well, every shop is a little bit different depending upon what I’m preparing for. When I’m going through produce, I’m always picking up bananas, blueberries, avocado. At our seafood counter, I’m looking at whatever’s coming fresh. I love our salmon. It’s one of my favorite products. In meat, it’s the ribeye. In cheese, I’m looking to see what artisan cheeses we have in place. Current favorites right now are Uplands and Jasper Hill as far as producers. The Harbison is actually one of my personal favorites. In our prepared foods, I hit the salad bar almost daily for lunch. And in center store, I’m always trying to check out whatever store I’m in, what are the local products? Local is a really important part of Whole Foods Market, so I love discovering new local favorites in whatever store I’m at.
ADI IGNATIUS:
I assume your certified cheese professional gets a little nervous when you walk up and ask what they’ve got?
JASON BUECHEL:
Not at all, because they know that I’m excited about a great conversation we’re going to have on some of their favorites. And usually it involves tasting a few samples as well, so always a great experience.
ADI IGNATIUS:
All right, well Jason, I want to thank you for being on the show. It’s really great to hear your thoughts, and thank you for being here.
JASON BUECHEL:
Thanks for having me.